Defensive Drop Pods -- 6th Edition v1.0

9/30/2013

As many of you guys know, one of my pride and joy lists in 5th Edition was the Defensive Drop Pod list that I semi-popularized with its finesse and manipulation tactics. It was extremely proficient and saw very, very few losses after the list was finalized. After much deliberation, tweaking, optimizing, and a whole lot of caffeine...its back. The DDP in 6th Edition has once again arrived to the Black Templars. Enjoy. ;)

HQ:
* Marshal w/ Primarch's Wrath and Artificer Armor. [130]
~ Command Squad (1x Apothecary, 4x Sword Brethren) w/ 2 Plasmaguns. Mounted in a Drop Pod. [180]

ELITES:
* Sword Brethren (5x Sternguard) w/ 2 Combi-Meltas and 1 Heavy Flamer. Mounted in a Drop Pod. [185]
* Sword Brethren (5x Sternguard) w/ 2 Combi-Meltas and 1 Heavy Flamer. Mounted in a Drop Pod. [185]
* Sword Brethren (5x Sternguard) w/ 2 Combi-Meltas and 1 Heavy Flamer. Mounted in a Drop Pod. [185]

TROOPS:
* Crusader Squad (1x Sword Brethren, 4x Initiates) w/ Combi-Melta and Plasmagun. Mounted in Drop Pod. [140]
* Crusader Squad (1x Sword Brethren, 4x Initiates) w/ Combi-Melta and Plasmagun. Mounted in Drop Pod. [140]
* Crusader Squad (1x Sword Brethren, 4x Initiates) w/ Combi-Melta and Plasmagun. Mounted in Drop Pod. [140]
* Crusader Squad (1x Sword Brethren, 4x Initiates) w/ Combi-Melta and Plasmagun. Mounted in Drop Pod. [140]
* Crusader Squad (1x Sword Brethren, 4x Initiates) w/ Combi-Melta and Plasmagun. Mounted in Drop Pod. [140]

FAST ATTACK:
* Assault Squad (1x Sergeant, 4x Initiates) w/ 2 Flamers. Mounted in a Drop Pod. [95]
* Assault Squad (1x Sergeant, 4x Initiates) w/ 2 Flamers. Mounted in a Drop Pod. [95]
* Assault Squad (1x Sergeant, 4x Initiates) w/ 2 Flamers. Mounted in a Drop Pod. [95]

Total: [1850]

I know there is nothing in the way of AA, but by nature of being full drop pod, I should avoid the worst of that. I'm just going to have to risk exposure to Heldrakes and other dangerous flyers, as its inefficient in a drop pod list to build in enough AA to take them down, while sticking to the DDP theme. Ideally, I'd have liked to take at least one flyer, but it just doesn't fit. So, what are we seeing? A total of 12 drop pods and 61 bodies. That is a whole lot of LOS blocking and board control. This also gives us a very nice even split of drop pods for the first turn and giving you a lot of options in the way of picking your alpha strike. This alpha strike is something that was really lacking in the 5th Edition DDP list, so its refreshing to regain some kill power.

There is plenty of AP2 in the list, but we've also got 3 squads of Sternguard who are also packing their special ammo for awesomeness. They are also armed with a heavy flamer each for those armies with 4+ or worse armor saves. But because you can't ever have enough template action (and they are dirtball cheap in a DP list), we've got 3 Assault squads packing 2 flamers each. They can easily burn away bubble-wrap units, hordes, or critically important units like Pathfinders. These flamers also discourage charges, via Overwatch. Just in case your opponent is fielding a good amount of vehicles (or Land Raiders), we've got plenty of Combi-Meltas (11) to bust them open.

This list is designed to pound you and distract you with its heavy hitters, blocking your progress forward into the battlefield with the drop pods. This is an extremely effective tactic against static armies like the Tau, even with their Intercept. While they are dealing with you there, you're busy claiming the objectives around the board with your troops and keeping out of LOS as needed until the game comes to a close. By the time your opponent is ready to come forward to try to claim/contest anything, it'll usually be too late. But remember, while it sounds awesome and easy...it isn't. This list, like its predecessor, will take you dozens of games to learn its intricacies. It is not an easy list to play. Its learning curve is extremely high and it takes a lot of planning, finesse, and skill to make it work. Get those games under your belt and you'll start to see a lot of wins.

Also, coming in the next couple days is a wonderful little challenge by Firepower. I've been spending the past couple days working on a solution to it, but it is definitely a worthy challenge! We'll take a look at it soon. With that, have a wonderful evening. ;)

35 Comments

Nathan

9/29/2013 08:07:16 pm

I like it! Lots of bodies on the ground, lots of options.

The only thing I don't like is the idea of buying and assembling 12 drop pods. I have 6, two assembled, and that was nightmarish.

Marshal Laeroth (Admin) link

9/30/2013 10:10:49 am

Definitely expensive. I borrow most of mine when I play. There is a couple players who run "black marines" who also have Drop Pods. I just steal them. I have these little white sticker things that I put onto the side that mark them as BT. They peel off nicely, so they don't do damage to the drop pod's paint job.

My assembly wasn't too bad...because I didn't do anything with the inside. I glued the suckers shut. lol

phatosen

9/29/2013 11:18:48 pm

Sweet list. Now I just need to get another job to pay for 12 Drop Pods. :D

9/30/2013 10:07:38 am

I know right? Totally worth it. ;)

Trignama

9/30/2013 04:27:07 am

Just one question here ML, if you are not taking the heavy weapon in the crusader squad to maximize the use of it, why not just take a normal tactical squad? That way you don't have to pay the extra 10 points for a guy to carry the combi weapon. You would save like 50 points that could possibly go elsewhere.

9/30/2013 09:22:20 am

You're right. And when I was building the list, I thought the exact same. But its Tactical squads man. Gah! Black Templars have Crusader squads! Nope, I'll take the 50 point hit! ;)

In all seriousness, though. Yeah...you could take the Tactical squad to save the 50 points each. Would give you some extra points to play with some wargear options on the Marshal/Command squad.

Mrpessimist

9/30/2013 05:29:38 am

You gain absolutely naught from taking CT:BT here, unless I'm missing something.

Ultramarines, Imperial Fists, Iron Hands, Salamanders, all of them do this list better. Re-rolls, increased durability, far more effective fire (no pun intended) from those flamers.

The Marshall's loadout is extremely questionable. That bolter, even with BS5, only kills 0.8 Marines. In a challenge he's on par with or worse than a Genestealer or two if my my memory serves me correct, which is a bit ridiculous.

I'm not questioning whether the list would actually hold up

Marshal Gaisgeach

9/30/2013 05:48:36 am

Agree with Mrpessimist -
I really really like this list.
However, if you run this list, I think you should run it as a imperial fists successor chapter. Or, give the Castellan a relic blade, the burning blade, or the teeth of terra, because at the moment he's kinda lackluster in challenges. Or, give him pedro cantor equivalent for crimson templars... making your sterngard scoring???
The only other suggestion I have is that I personally am not sure about the command squad, and if you want to include more AA you could possibly remove the command squad and put in things like two TFC, two hunter/stalkers, (two storm talons if you move points around)???

9/30/2013 10:06:23 am

I covered most of your comment in the response I gave to Mrpessimist. However, you asked about the AA. The reason I don't take any AA is because for the amount of points it would take to have something in my list to reliably kill AV12 flyers in the numbers they are dangerous, I need 400-500 points invested in them. If its just one Heldrake, I can ignore it. Its no big deal. If you have three? Then I have to ignore it anyway, because I can't fit all that AA into the list and it still function the way its supposed to. And the only thing I'd be able to take would be Flyers, because everything needs to be in reserve when the game starts, or I'm forced to deploy them on turn one...where they will get annihilated.

Command squad is there for the plasmaguns. But more importantly, it allows the Marshal to start the game in reserve via the command squad's dedicated drop pod. Unfortunately, due to the reserve rules, if he doesn't have a dedicated drop pod himself (which is impossible without a command squad), he has to start the game on the board because he's the only unit that is applicable for the 50% deployment rule.

9/30/2013 09:59:16 am

Alas! But you do gain something! Of the armies you listed, only the Iron Hands would be one that could do a comparable job of this list. And outside of that, Raven Guard. The others do not fit what the list tries to do, but could do it passably, though it wouldn't work in the same way. But don't worry, because I'm going to be reposting a "How To" on the list.

Anyway, I'll give you the short and sweet version: the list does not win by killing things. It wins by distracting, manipulating, and creating board control with your drop pods and several units that ARE able to cause havoc. By doing this, your opponent is severely hampered from achieving the mission objectives. In 5th Edition, Kill Point missions were harder to accomplish...but with this new codex, they are just as easy to complete as any other mission with proper pod placement. But again, I'll be updating my "How To" on this. You (saying "you" generally) really need to get out of the offensive mindset with this list, because that is not what it does. Most people can't do this and that's why they have trouble with the list. I did not lie when I say it takes dozens of games to learn how to play the list. Once you're able to do that though, you will win FAR more than lose.

Anyway, getting back to why its good for BT, RG, and IH...these chapters have defensive tactics. They grant staying power. In the case of BT, its challenge potential (even with a bolter, they will cause 0.417 wounds against a MEQ dude. Not great, but still decent for no gear. We also have Adamantum Will, which is definitely a nice tool to have. Some would argue that we get targeted by psychic powers anymore, but its not true. I could list a dozen widely used spells right off the top of my head right now that target us. And we definitely don't want them going off. Lastly, and most important, we have something that allows us to redeploy our forces quicker than the others: Crusader. People whine and complain about the actual merits of the run mechanic and how Crusader fits into it, but then...that might be why they aren't winning more games. Running is an important part of our gameplay and being able to reliably get a higher number on that roll is huge. In a list that is static once the drop pods land, we need all the movement we can get.

Iron Hand's CT should be pretty self-explanatory. They get Feel No Pain on 6+ (blah) and It Won't Die (blah). But they do get something cool in that they get Mastercrafted items for each character, which is awesome for the combi-meltas. Honestly, I think that the IH are the weakest of the CT's by far. It would be *okay* in this list to use IH, but I wouldn't personally. Raven Guard have something similar, in that they gain Stealth for the first turn on the board. While nothing to write home about (IH is better usually), if you're playing Nightfighting or land in cover, you get a much better cover save as a result for that first turn. Which benefits your distraction force greatly. Nevertheless, IH is still probably better and I'd probably take BTs still because of Crusaders and Adamantium Will.

I went the Marshal's wargear because it was cheap and does reasonable damage to anything not 2+/3+. The first version I made of this list I had a Relic Blade, Storm Shield, and Artificer Armor. I needed the points, so I made some changes. And really...I don't really care about the HQ and the command squad. Its mostly there because I have to have a HQ and I needed the command squad (plus the plasma is nice). They are part of the distraction unit force anyway. Obviously, I don't want to be stupid with him and give up free objective points, but this list is designed to have cheap threats all around. The Feel No Pain helps though. As for the challenges, they can go right ahead and charge me. Unless packing a Str 8+ weapon, they won't be killing me anytime soon. And that charge just furthers the overall list's ability to win the objective game. :)

chadsteam

10/1/2013 04:00:05 pm

Just to add to the run merits...I won a relic game last week because of Crusader. On turn 4, I made the mistake of clumping my CC unit with attached Warlord too close together when I grabbed the relic (and then failed my charge) and lost the whole unit to ordinance, except the Warlord. Since I no longer had a scoring unit in remote proximity to the relic, we were heading towards a tie. My 5 man ML squad jumped out of their building they were camped in and sprinted on turn 5 and 6 to claim the relic objective as the game ended. Had I not had the better run rolls from the 2D6, I would have probably ended up short of the relic as each turn I lost my front runner in the squad.

Alaster link

9/2/2014 11:52:30 am

Hi! I stumbled on your site the other day while doing some research about Black Templars as I'm starting up a small collection of them. I mainly play Space Wolves though and I've been struggling on deciding how to run them with my new codex. Do you think this list concept could be applied well to my army?

ribster

9/30/2013 08:04:30 am

As has been said, not exclusive to templars, nothing stopping many other chapters doing this is there? More to the point, I think I have maybe 5 pods, not sure I want to stump up for another 7...

9/30/2013 09:23:42 am

Aye, the list is extremely expensive. When I play it myself, I borrow the remaining drop pods from other players. :)

But yes, you are correct. There is nothing stopping other armies from running this list. Which is exactly why I made it the way I did. :P

Soul Drinker

9/30/2013 08:39:49 am

I might be wrong on this but isn't this list invalid because you have to have a percentage of your army on the table... I guess you can leave some units out of the their drop pods and still do this though. I personally would put some heavy weapons in the crusader squads so they have something to do because they have to have something deployed at the beginning of the game.

9/30/2013 09:27:23 am

You're half right. You DO have to have 50% of your army on the board come turn one, as per reserve rules. However, in those same set of rules, it also says that if your units have to start in reserve (i.e. flyers/drop pods), they do not count for the unit requirement for deploying on the board.

That is why you need to take the Command squad. That way the Marshal and Command squad counts as a single squad and can take a dedicated transport. Otherwise he has to start on the board, as he doesn't have a drop pod dedicated to him.

Urkh

9/30/2013 05:22:55 pm

You actually don't need the command squad's dedicated transport for the marshal to be legal. As per the rules for deepstrike (not reserves) in the special rules section of the BRB, "When working out how many units can be placed in reserve, units that must be deployed by Deep Strike (ALONG WITH ANY MODELS EMBARKED UPON THEM), are ignored.

Read the shift held part. Either way, if you want the command squad, take the command squad. I'm highly interested in a full drop pod list, and am slowly going to be building my drop pod force as i obtain the money for it.

hippo

9/30/2013 02:52:29 pm

How are you blocking LOS? Just because you glued the doors shut doesn't mean they're actually shut..

9/30/2013 03:04:10 pm

Oh course not. They are simply glued shut out of convenience, not gaming purposes. However...have you ever seen that many drop pods on the board? There is lots of LOS blocking, especially when you consider the other terrain on the board. ;) Also, a drop pod easily provides LOS blocking for a 5-man squad against infantry based shooting with proper placement; even with DPs that has the doors open. Try it. :)

Algesan

9/30/2013 08:18:50 pm

Laeroth is right on two counts: It takes lots of games to get any variation of this list down. Expect to lose for a while, just learn from it.

Yes, you can hide a MSU behind a drop pod fairly trivially, especially if you install the interior stuff.

Need more Drop Pods?
http://algesansblog.weebly.com/2/post/2011/02/posterboard-drop-pod.html

Got Rhinos too:
http://algesansblog.weebly.com/2/post/2011/02/post-title-click-and-type-to-edit.html

Zeruvar

10/1/2013 12:28:35 am

Missed out on the plasma guns in the command squad. They cant take special weapons, only the combis or storm bolters.

10/1/2013 12:31:22 am

That got Errata'd the second day the codex was out. Its in the codex FAQ.

greggles

10/1/2013 10:56:24 am

Something that I'm sure everyone knows, but not might realize...

Those drop pods are outputting 24 bolter shots a turn...

Speaking from someone who has killed the swarm lord with a storm bolter off a rhino...never discount that amount of firepower. Heck I usually try to spend the 5 points (yay point deduction) cost on my rhino's to add a second one!

10/2/2013 06:07:42 pm

The sad part...every bit of fluff written calls for the stormbolter to be either S5 AP5 or S4 AP4 since it is supposedly a more powerful weapon than a normal bolter. Either option would fill the slot between bolter/heavy bolter.

Jonny Zor

10/8/2013 07:06:27 am

Ya, one time I had a pod's storm bolter kill a TFC lol

10/9/2013 12:44:37 pm

Ah, yes. While I don't forget about them in the game, it is something I forgot to mention in the article itself. Those storm bolter shots add up over the course of the game. My opponents are always surprised at how much damage they can put out when all added together. Though, I will admit...I did like the old Deathwind Launcher prior to its 5th Edition FAQ nerf. Those big pie plates were amazing.

Brother Adama

10/7/2013 09:00:31 am

This list is so cool. But it will take sometime to really master it, as you say. The last years I have run pure drop lists with 6-8 pods in them. And one can really manipulate the board with that many pods. I even sometime have problem getting them where I want them since there is simply no space left. Now 12 pods, that is just so cool!

10/9/2013 12:23:28 pm

Haha. I love me some drop pod armies. Their wide-spread use fits exactly the tactical style that I favor: Manipulating the battlefield to my advantage, while maintaining a defensive plan, until I can counter-attack appropriately. ;)

10/8/2013 07:03:15 am

Hello All
Thank you Marshall for updating your DP list to 6th. I have learned a lot reading your blog. One point I would like to add, from rrunning a marines list that included DPStern, at first I was running the combi-melt, hvy flamer but found once you have shot your combi, you're done shooting melta. So I changed it to include a regular MeltaMan and had more kills right away in games. In fact one game the pod came down right in the face of an IG line, no scatter and 27 dead guardsmen later......{chuckle snort}
Thanks again for the great blog, keep it up!

10/9/2013 12:40:15 pm

Hello! I'm glad to hear you're finding everything useful! That is definitely the goal, but I hope people enjoy it as well. ;)

The reason I didn't give them a meltagun (I thought about it), was because the only time I was really using the meltagun was the turn the unit dropped. So I really only needed one shot out of them. Having two gives me a reasonable chance to hit, but if I am not facing vehicles, I still can use the bolter portion of the combi-weapon to full effect. :D

Jason

10/8/2013 05:29:33 pm

I adapted this list for a Pedro led Crimson Fist army:

Pedro Cantor - 185
Goes in a drop pod with one of the Sternguard squads

Tactical 135
veteran sergeant w/combi -flamer, 4 marines 1 w/heavy bolter, drop pod

Tactical - 135
veteran sergeant w/combi-flamer, 4 marines 1 w/heavy bolter, drop pod

Tactical - 135
veteran sergeant w/combi-grav, 4 marines 1 w/heavy bolter, drop pod

Tactical- 135
veteran sergeant w/combi-grav, 4 marines 1 w/heavy bolter, drop pod

Tactical - 135
veteran sergeant w/combi-plasma, 4 marines 1 w/heavy bolter, drop pod

Sternguard 185
3 veterans w/storm bolter, 1/heavy flamer, 1 w/grav-gun, drop pod

Sternguard 185
3 veterans w/storm bolter, 1/heavy flamer, 1 w/grav-gun, drop pod

Sternguard 185
3 veterans w/storm bolter, 1/heavy flamer, 1 w/grav-gun, drop pod

Devastators - 195
2 rocket launchers w/flakk missiles, 2 las cannons, drop pod

Devastators- 195
2 rocket launchers w/flakk missiles, 2 las cannons, drop pod

Devastators - 195
2 rocket launchers w/flakk missiles, 2 las cannons, drop pod

Comes to 2000 points.

I'll also try it with my Templars.

10/9/2013 12:36:15 pm

Crimson Fists would do this list well too, I had forgotten them. Pedro making Sternguard scoring makes for some additional tactical options. I can live with the Devastators in this list (though, I'd probably take something else tbh...), as the IF chapter tactics makes them semi-viable and it gives you a source of AF if needed. With that being said, I feel the Heavy Bolters are kind of forced in this list. It doesn't really scream "necessary", even with the IF chapter tactics. I also think, unless playing in a comped environment, some consistency on the combi's is best. And since you're seriously lacking in the melta department... ;)

10/13/2013 04:59:01 pm

Took your advice as well as another look at your list. 2000k exactly. I like your BT list also. The two armies I play are the Black Templars and Crimson Fists. For Dorn and the Emperor!

Pedro Kantor - 185

Tactical 130
sergeant w/combi-melta, 3 w/ bolter, 1 w/plasma gun ,drop pod

Tactical 130
sergeant w/combi-melta, 3 w/ bolter, 1 w/plasma gun ,drop pod

Tactical 130
sergeant w/combi-melta, 3 w/ bolter, 1 w/plasma gun ,drop pod

Tactical 130
sergeant w/combi-melta, 3 w/ bolter, 1 w/plasma gun ,drop pod

Tactical 130
sergeant w/combi-melta, 3 w/ bolter, 1 w/plasma gun ,drop pod

Sternguard 200
1 veteran, w/boltgun, 3 w/combi-melta, 1/heavy flamer, drop pod
Pedro deploys with this squad

Sternguard 190
2 veterans w/boltgun, 2 w/combi-melta, 1/heavy flamer, drop pod

Sternguard 190
2 veterans w/boltgun, 2 w/combi-melta, 1/heavy flamer, drop pod

Devastators - 195
2 rocket launchers w/flakk missiles, 2 las cannons, drop pod

Devastators- 195
2 rocket launchers w/flakk missiles, 2 las cannons, drop pod

Devastators - 195
2 rocket launchers w/flakk missiles, 2 las cannons, drop pod

9/6/2014 01:11:53 pm

@ Alaster

Hello! Glad to see you're joining the Crusade! What size (points) force are you looking at?

9/9/2014 09:28:08 am

I'm looking at mostly 1850 point tournaments in my area. My wolves kind of have defensive chapter tactics in that they are mostly an assault deterrant (3 attacks on the charge, 3 when charged) for my grey hunters at 16 points per model, we don't have anything super mobile that goes in drop pods but we can stuff a bunch of combis in a pod like you can with sternguard.

Defensive Drop Pods -- 6th Edition v1.0

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