Email: How to you beat Tyranids?

11/9/2011

Email: "How do you beat Nids? What's the target priority? I'm running an EC, chaplin, marshal, LRC, a vindy, a pred, a rhino with 9 int with cc and bolt pistol, a razor back with 5 marines, 8 ASSALT termies, and 8 shooty termies."

Reply: Well, I think we can help you out! Let's take a look!

Fortunately, we're in luck against the Nids as our guns are typically AP 2/3, so we'll be ignoring their big guy's armor. This target priority is going to be pretty much universal no matter what army list you're playing, but is subject to change in game depending on your situation. So use your best judgement.

1) The first thing you should always try to shoot is Tervigons. They are difficult to get in cover due to the Monstrous Creature rules, but are extremely nasty if left alive. As one of the few legitimate Synapse creatures in Nid lists, they need to die early to disrupt Synapse. Not only that, they spawn free troops and give out Feel No Pain like candy. This is bad news bears.

2) Okay, this isn't entirely true. If your opponent has a Venomthrope, they need to die to shooting first. They give automatic 5+ cover saves to any Nid within 6", so this is how they'll protect their Monstrous Creatures. Thus, they need to die if taken in a list.

3) Now any other Monstrous Creature needs to die. Primarily Tyrannofexes, Trygons, and/or Harpies. If your opponent has a Hive Tyrant, but has other Monstrous Creatures on the board, ignore the Hive Tyrant. You'll just have to play damage control with it with sacrificial units. You don't have enough guns to kill that many MCs. If only Tervigons and Hive Tyrants are there, then simply shoot the Tyrant as normal.

4) Shoot and kill anything that can kill your vehicles that wasn't covered above. This means Zoanthropes, Hive Guard, and Genestealers. You can normally just hid in your transports against the Nids and their isn't much they can do, but if they can kill the vehicles, you're in trouble. So these elements either need to be killed, or neutralized/tied up in some fashion. Obviously charging Genestealers is a bad idea, so shoot them. Likewise, Hive Guard aren't all that great in CC, so you can deal with them in that phase if needed.

5) Any other synapse creature still alive and camping near crucial enemy objectives need to die. Until they go away, you're not going to be able to use tank shocking against them.

6) Shoot and kill any other CC dangerous units. The only one really remaining that I've not already listed is Raveners. But they can REALLY hurt you bad if you let them, so don't let them. Pro tip: Str 8+ weapons are not their friend.

7) Kill their troops so you can claim objectives. Tank shocking them off objectives is also a great option if you killed the Synapse creatures. Just don't under-estimate the power of Termagaunts in close combat, especially if they have adrenal glands and toxin sacs.

So using this guideline, in a hypothetical game, against a basic 2000 point Nid list. Its probably not uber competitive, but it uses the basic "core" units that make Nids decent. Remember, the game situation determines target priority most times (which you learn based on experience), but I can give you a basic outline of what to do.

2x Tyranid Primes (HQ)
3x 2-man Hive Guard (Elite)
2x Tervigon (Troops)
2x Termagaunts (Troops)
2x Genestealers (Troops)
2x Raveners (Fast Attack)
2x Tyrannofexes (Heavy Support)

So against this list, you'd shoot the Tervigons first. This should take you 1-2 turns to take them down. After that, you move on to the Tyrannofexes. They are both MCs and reliable AT against our army, so they need to die ASAP. This will be more difficult, as they will likely have cover. If your deployment marginalizes the firepower of the Rupture Cannon, you can get around shooting them if you need to. Hive Guard come next if you have shots on them. If you don't, try to set up charges against them. This might not be available, as most Nid players stagger their lines so you'll have to get through Termagaunts first. Genestealers would also be a valid target here.

Next, because the Tyranid Primes give Synapse and are CC units, they need to go. If they are running around by themselves, they make easy targets. If they are attached to a unit, ignore them. If this is the case, shoot the Raveners. After this, its basically clean up. If you killed the Synapse, you can now try to tank shot stuff around the board (if it doesn't have very good AT abilities!!!). But the most important thing is to remember to stay in your transports as long as possible. Close combat units are the exception to this, but they absolutely need to be actually KILLING something, else they should be in their vehicles for protection. Tyranids win by overwhelming you. They can't do that if they can't get to you because they can't hurt your Rhino/Razorback/Land Raider!

Hope this helps! :)

5 Comments

doomarn

11/9/2011 11:22:05 pm

Not bad. I assume your talking about your gunline list vs the nidz when calculating that you will kill a tervigon in 1-2 turns.
I however disagree with the priority a little, the tervigons are not a problem early game, your biggest problem is the hive guards and second the tyrannofex.
Those bastards kill your transports from turn 1. and you dont want to footslog towards genestealers and raveners. because they will charge you and wreck havoc.

Lets say am playing my 2k list vs that Tyranid list.
My list is
EC- Accept any C
Marshal - Lclaw,SS,Frag,holy orb
Techmarine - SS,frag
Dreadnought - AC, HF,X-A,Smoke in drop pod
Dreadnought - AC,HF, X-A,Smoke in drop pod
3x 7/2 crusader squad - PF,Melta in Rhinos: X-A, smoke
2x5 Crusader squad - Las,Plas
Typhoon
Typhoon
Vindicator - Potms, X-A
Vindicator - Potms, X-A
.....
So lets say the nid player knows what he is doing, that means he will screen tervigons and tyrannofex with hiveguards and hiveguards with termagaunts, If he gets first turn he will not screen raveners with gaunts and just trust in the odds that you will not sieze. The Genestealers will either outflank or infiltrate depending on terrain, But not important because we are talking about Kill priority.

So Hiveguards, Damn i hate those guys. My list isnt a gunline so i want to move forward to put pressure on. That means rhinos and vindicators moves forward at maximum speed. Here is also depending on terrain but since i got the movement advantage i would most likely just storm one of the flanks and work my way in. the Typhoon will be setup far away from his Hiveguards to just stand and shoot until needed for anything else, the small crusader squads just sit near objective(s) hopefully in cover blasting away. I can opt to go with the dreads or drop them. Also depending on terrain and if he infiltrate genestealers or outflank them.

So First priority will be hiveguards since i cant utilize the cover as much as vs the tyrannofexes. also the Hive guards is 4 wounds T6 so its easier for me to take a unit out than a tyrannofex or tervigon. After Hiveguards are gone am in CC range anyway so i will shoot the big MCs that i cant drag into CC and just do my thing. Here i will try to multi charge gaunts + a MC to make him take fearless saves since its hard to wound MCs in CC with only str 4.

Now this is just theoreticly because sometimes the first priority is the ravengers or the genestealers since you deployment didnt go well or he messed up with his deployment and his hiveguards wont get shots in until turn 3, so you can hold back a little, shoot the dangerous CC units then move forward and proceed to take out the rest.

Sorry for such a long comment. Just my 2 cents on how i play vs nidz

//Stefan

Algesan link

11/10/2011 01:26:45 pm

If a Doom of Mylanta (so misnamed because of the massive stomach acid problems it caused me the first time I met one) is in the list, it must die immediately. S8 weaponry, apply as needed until Instant Death kicks in.

Marshal Laeroth (Admin) link

11/10/2011 05:20:03 pm

@ Algesan

There are always exceptions to the rule. I've not seen Doom on a table since they were nerfed appropriately, but they are still dangerous if we decide to walk around. So yes, they would need to die fairly early.

@ Doomarn

Aye, this isn't a perfect and 100% always follow priority list. It is just how I go about things. I wasn't necessarily addressing it via my gunline, but any list with a reasonable amount of firepower (i.e. Typhoons, Predators, Dreads, and/or CML Termies).

I would say Hive Guard need to go first, but they are usually hiding behind staggered lines to gain cover. Or more likely, behind LOS blocking terrain where you cannot even get a shot off. The reason I target the Tervigons is because of their utility for the Nid player. If they are in the list, if you can kill it early, it'll blow up the Termagaunts nearby, disrupt Synapse, and prevent them from using FNP on crucial units (i.e. Tyrannofexes, Trygons, Hive Guard). I typically can kill the Hive Guard in close combat after the Tervigon dies.

The Tyrannofexes are #2 on my priority list, so we're in agreement there. Well, besides the Tervigon thing. The Venomthrope is a kinda-sorta sometimes see thing. :D

But you are 100% correct that a player's target priority will depend on the mission, the deployment type, terrain, and how each person deployed. There might be a situation that pops up that requires you to throw the normal priority out the window. But its nice to see a list of basic "To Do's". And even better that there are people voicing their own list (i.e. you). :D

Doomarn

11/10/2011 07:25:11 pm

@ Marshal Laeroth I had to include the list so i could give the readers a clear view on how i was thinking. =)

Since they nerfed the Doom, its even more important to have your transports alive. Regarding Venomthrope, I havent had the pleasure to face them yet. But a creature that gives everything coversave,, yeah that one need to die asap.

11/14/2011 12:52:00 am

Speaking of the Doom, for 90 points, I don't see why it doesn't get taken a lot. Yes, it is a distraction unit, but with 3++ it is nasty, at least to any drop army. The trick of it going off in both shooting phases is what makes it so nasty.

Anyway, at 1850, I deployed with my TLLC Ven Dread & 5x LS-Typhoons on the board. Everything else was in reserve. The Doom then proceeded to make saves for the next 4 turns, although the fact that I had the most non-shooting Marines ever, according to my opponent anyway, but that might have been when I shoot 4 Krak + 10 Storm Bolter shots and proceed to miss with everything except the one Storm Bolter round and it fails to wound. Three times in the game. Or the three intact MSU squads with 4xBolter & 1xMeltagun (and the Storm Bolters in their drop pods) unloading in RF range at a group of 5xGenestealers + 1xBroodlord. And barely managing the last wound.

I personally have decided that my EC needs a serious counseling session before his OER performance review comes up. Versus a WS3, T6, W6, big shooty critter of some sort, that had already taken two wounds (one from Ven Dread TLLC, one from Neophyte Bolt Pistol), took an additional chainsword wound from one of the Initiates when it charged in (the poor Neophyte Brothers were dead from foul xenos bioweapons); the supposed "Emperor's Champion" managed to spend five rounds in combat while only scoring 2 more wounds. Potentially, the beast could have been slain in each of these rounds.

The second wound scored was on the next to the last round when the EC after allowing for five Initiate Brothers to die around him because he couldn't handle his job. The EC now having no excuses, stepped up to solo the beast as a Champion should...and promptly missed all three swings and their rerolls. The beast swings back, scoring all three wounds, the EC fails one invulnerable save. Of course, having lost combat 0-1, a fearless save must be made. Oops.

He might be getting fired.

Email: How to you beat Tyranids?

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